Regenerative farmer and author Charles Massey joins the program to discuss the ideas presented in his (recently updated and re-released) book, Call Of The Reed Warbler: A New Agriculture, A New Earth. In this long-form interview, Charles and host Amy Mullins reflect on the highly successful range of practices involved in regenerative agriculture and just what can be achieved with it. This is as compared with our predominant industrial agricultural system that is rooted in modern day capitalism and colonial farming practices brought across from Europe. These industrial practices came from post-Enlightenment ideas of control and domination over the landscape and still inform many farming practices today, for example, “when you over-clear your woodlands and overgraze your deep-rooted grasses, salt rises. We now have millions of hectares of dry-land salinity and it’s increasing.”

Charles and Amy also discuss the unique ecology of Australia's ancient continent and how we can learn from both modern soil science and Australia's First Nations peoples in managing the land and use farming practices that enable nature's complex ecology to harmonise and regenerate. Plus, Charles tells us about some of our most urgent environmental and health crises and just how critical a role regenerative agriculture can play in addressing them. Says Charles, "Research shows that the number one best pathway to pull carbon dioxide back out of the Earth and buried in the soil is through regenerative agriculture... [so] we’re number one at addressing climate, and number one at addressing the modern human health crisis..."