Professor James Curran delves into the behind-the-scenes discussions and real intentions behind the AUKUS agreement and Australia's plan to obtain nuclear submarines from the US and the UK. How exactly does the US perceive AUKUS? James reveals to host Amy Mullins how the US' view differs greatly from the Australian government's view. With so many practical questions weighing around the delivery of the submarines and the cooperation of the US, UK, and Australian navies, does Australia have a Plan B? James also talks about Putin's recent trip to East Asia, as well as Australia's stabilised relations with the People's Republic of China and what it means for the (re)developing relationship. James Curran is International Editor of the AFR and Professor of Modern History at the University of Sydney. In our discussion he talks about his essay on AUKUS in the Australian Book Review, 'AUKUS in the Dock: Questions and challenges for the Albanese government.' Read his ABR essay here and his AFR columns here.