For International Women's Day, award-winning author and science journalist Angela Saini  joins Amy from New York to delve into the origins of "the patriarchy" and gendered oppression and finds that patriarchal societies are a far more recent historical development than we might imagine. Drawing on the extensive research from her latest book, The Patriarchs: How Men Came To Rule, Angela explains our fascination with matriarchy and women-led matrilineal societies and reveals that many different types of matrilineal societies successfully exist across the world today. Angela explains how patriarchy is not inevitable and what feminists and people seeking a gender equal world can do to turn the tide. The Patriarchs was shortlisted for the 2023 Orwell Prize. It's published by Harper Collins Australia.

Angela's previous books are, Inferior: How Science Got Women Wrong, and Superior: The Return of Race Science.

This is the extended full version of the interview with Angela Saini.